TAS In Session: Karen Elson
Singer and songwriter Karen Elson is the first to admit that she had an unusual set of circumstances to overcome when she released her debut album, The Ghost Who Walks, last year.
As a highly successful model, her pale, luminous countenance gracing Vogue and Chanel's catwalk, the Manchester-born Elson was known more as a beautiful face until she married The White Stripes' Jack White and moved to Nashville. When it was announced that she'd be releasing a record last year, The Ghost Who Walks, it seemed an incongruous leap, perhaps fueled on by her husband. But Elson, a longtime member of The Citizens Band, has written songs for years, long before meeting White. As she revealed to The Alternate Side when she visited our studios last fall, she found her natural balance not teetering down a runway in stilettos, but sitting with a guitar and exploring the darker reaches of her musical imagination, inspired by folk, blues and murder ballads.
Elson brought along her beloved 1917 guitar, bought at Nashville's Gruhn Guitars, and was accompanied by her friend and Citizens Band compadre Rachelle Garniez on accordion. The duo played four songs from The Ghost Who Walks, including the title track and "Stolen Roses," the very last song Elson written for the record. The interview will also air on TAS' sister station 90.7 WFUV this Wednesday, January 12, at 9 p.m. EST which you can also stream here.
And the mother of two, who turns 32 this Friday, isn't chucking her modeling career now that she's won rock 'n' roll credibility; she appears on the cover of the February issue of Japan's Vogue.
Alisa: You’ve brought along a friend today ….
Karen Elson: Yes, I’ve brought along Rachelle Garniez who is a brilliant New York City based musician and songwriter and she also plays in my band. And she plays the accordion! I’m in a New York based cabaret called The Citizens Band and that’s how I met Rachelle because she’s been a very important part of The Citizens Band, the musical director. Rachelle was always very supportive of me as a singer and songwriter and she really encouraged me when it was time to start making my record, to go out and be bold.
Alisa: So do you feel bold right now?
Karen: I don’t know! (laughs). I feel happy. I’m finally doing what I love so there’s definitely a lot of joy coming from playing, singing and being around some really inspiring people. It’s definitely a contrast.
Alisa: So this is something you’ve been meaning to get to for a while?
Karen: I’ve been in the cabaret for a good six years and even when I first moved to New York I was involved in various musical projects, but what I wanted to be when I was younger was to play music. Where I grew up in England it was a very northern, working class, industrial town. I didn’t know any musicians. My family didn’t. They were just hard-working people. A musical dream was in your imagination, an escape, something in your head. Not actualized. So when I became a model it was like winning the lottery in a way. I had to do it because if I didn’t, I’d be working in a supermarket for the rest of my life. I wasn’t expecting modeling to be successful. Far from it. I was hoping it would give me a little bit of money so I could eventually find a good guitar teacher and somehow do all of that. Luckily, it did do all of that. But I also became really successful as a model. It took me really by surprise and at the same time, you don’t want to bite the hand that feeds you. I’ve traveled the world thanks to being a model and as much as people want to say that the fashion industry is horribly vapid, I’ve met some brilliant people. Even The Citizens Band; I wouldn’t have [met them] had it not been for people in fashion who I knew who connected me. Fashion was my connection to music, ultimately. It wasn’t the only connection, shall I say, but because I lived in New York City as a model …
Alisa: So you didn’t have a passion for your modeling career?
Karen: It’s funny. I’m a girl who likes clothes, don’t get me wrong, and I respect what the photographers and designers are doing. But it wasn’t an aspiration of mine to become a model, it wasn’t something that I wanted to work hard to be number one. It just happened. But I had to make the most of it because it does have a finite timeline. I’m 31 now and, oh my gosh, I’ve been doing it for 15 years. I have some really good friends now in fashion so it’s one of those things that I do. I wouldn’t give it up because why would I give up 15 formative years? But I am in my element when I’m singing. You know what I mean? You have that feeling where you’re doing what you’re here to do. It’s not just, “this feels good.” No, it’s “this feels right.”
[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BcLhpFcRl4]
Karen: I live in Nashville and I love the storytelling down there. It’s fascinating to me, a lot of old country songs of the 40s and 50s. Just the visual narrative to me is fascinating. So when I was writing songs for this record I really wanted to focus on that. And not necessarily write, “Oh God, woe is me” or whatever because who really wants to hear about a model who saw, “Oh! I don’t feel good today.” I’d rather write a song that is evocative of a narrative and weaves a little story. So for “Cruel Summer,” I was going to write a story about a big, fat storm coming along and ripping everything apart, but use it as a metaphor as country artists did in the Fifties as an emotional crisis.
Alisa: There’s some great imagery in that [song], catching her long black hair ….
Karen: Twirling her long, black hair ….
Alisa: It’s actually really funny because you normally hear of fiery redheads ....
Karen: Well, I could have said red hair. But black hair … I just had that character in my head.
Alisa: So there was a conscious decision not to be too biographical.
Karen: Well, not every song. You can’t help but put your life experience into it. I don’t want to be detached from the song, so to speak. I think I really have been writing songs for so long that the songs I wrote before this record were autobiographical and slightly indulgent in that sense and I just got so tired of it. I wanted to challenge myself and write a story. The next song I’m going to sing, “The Ghost Who Walks,” was a nickname I had when I was younger, for being pale and slightly brooding I guess, but the story obviously has nothing to do with me. It’s about a girl who goes out to a lake with her love and gets slaughtered by the man she loves and now she’s a ghost haunting the tall grass. Yeah. Obviously not autobiographical!
[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uYL43ut70Y]
Alisa: Kind of a dark record? Tales of love, betrayal, murder ….
Karen: Crimes of passion.
Alisa: Have you always been into music with a darker edge?
Karen: I guess so. Yeah. One of my favorite songs is Hank Williams’ “Ramblin' Man.” The chords as well and the lyrics are just very sad, dark. Beautiful. I just have a connection to that feeling, I guess. It just comes out when I write songs; I’m not able to write a happy-go-lucky tune. I wish I were!
Alisa: You can’t write “Shiny, Happy People.”
Karen: No. I love Michael Stipe. He’s awesome!
Alisa: I read that a song that really resonated with you was a PJ Harvey song.
Karen: When I was a teenager, as I mention, [I had] a very working class, industrial upbringing. [So] musically I can understand why pop music is so big because it’s an escape. Boy bands and all that stuff. I remember being 14 and watching TV and on Saturday mornings there was this show that just played music videos - there was no interjection - of a very indie variety. And there was this one song, “Down By The Water,” and the video was just bewitching. PJ Harvey is just doing this magical, enchanting, gypsy dance and the song … it was devastating. You see a woman being in touch with the darker side of herself; I found it very fascinating. Again, I connected with it. And what I love about music in general is that you have these contemporary people that you love and you find out who they love and the history behind that. I remember reading in an inteview that PJ Harvey loved Howling Wolf and got into that and obviously got into Nick Cave. And when I bought Murder Ballads I wanted to know where those songs came from and bought the Smithsonian Fokways box set which had a ton of murder ballads on that collection. I love that about music; there’s always a song you don’t know. There’s always something to learn, something that’s inspired. You’re never lost, you’re never alone with music.
Alisa: So what have you heard recently that people have suggested?
Karen: Well, I’ve been playing with the Speaking Clock Revue that T-Bone Burnett has pulled together and it’s been Elton John, Leon Russell, John Mellencamp, Greg Allman, Neko Case - who I worship - and so many brilliant people. But I’ve been really into The Secret Sisters, these two girls from Alabama who have voices and harmonies; I can’t even explain how beautiful they are and how talented these girls are. I also met the Punch Brothers recently who are a brilliant bunch of musicians and great people as well. The bar has been raised; I’ve just been meeting these people who are so ridiculously talented that it’s been really fun and inspiring.
Alisa: Does that feel a little ....
Karen: Overwhelming? Yes! They’re really talented and gifted but at the same time, how wonderful to be in the company of such people and learn stuff! The Secret Sisters ... those girls are so special and I can only hope that they blow up into being huge. I want kids to listen to that kind of music. Same thing with the Punch Brothers; their music is so interesting and thoughtful.
Alisa: And speaking of talented company, your husband Jack White knows his way around the music scene.
Karen: He certainly does. Jack’s been nothing but supportive about my music from day one. He knew that I was singing when we met and that I was in The Citizens Band and he came to a few Citizens Band shows. It’s funny because we’ve got two kids as well and for the longest time I had a devil on my shoulder [saying] that this was a hopeless dream to make a record. I’m in a cabaret and collaborate with a bunch of people, but to do my own thing, it’s going to get slammed. The devil kept telling me, “You’re a model, you’ve got the Jack White connection,” and as great as those things could be, they could also make people not appreciate that the creative process was mine. But I had to flick the devil off of my shoulder one day and say, you know, there’s always people who are going to judge you and have preconceived ideas, but the one thing you can do is stand up, be bold, and do what I love and sing my heart out. But it took a while to get there. Once I recorded the record and started to go on tour and play live, I realized this is what I love more than anything. You can’t get hung up too much on what other people think. But people have been so supportive and wonderfully kind about my record that it’s been more fuel for the fire.
Alisa: Do you read reviews?
Karen: I try not to because I read a couple and some good and some “Mrs. Jack White, the model ...” and I though, oh, this isn’t going to be good. For me, I got a little healthy distance because while I want to know what strangers think of my record, at the same time, I want to preserve the sanctity of how I make songs and not do it for anything but what’s aching inside me. That’s really important to me. If I write a song that I think other people will like, I’ll probably mess up, but if I write a song that speaks to me, I think that’s when something magical happens.
[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRkMoQcIxSA]
Alisa: How do you digging living in Nashville? You’ve been there about five years?
Karen: Yes, five years. I love Nashville. There’s a lot of creativity that goes on down there and I know a lot of brilliant people. But I’m not entirely in Nashville; I travel quite a bit and consider New York to be a second home still. I have a very strong affection for New York. I lived here from when I was 17 to … when did I have kids? Four and a half years ago! New York’s got my heart.
Alisa: I understand that you wrote most of the songs for the album in secret?
Karen: It sounds so corny, in secret. Yeah, I felt very protective of what I was doing and for my own self I wanted my own voice to ring clear. Once I felt ready, Rachelle and I wrote a couple of songs together too. Once I got in the studio too … there’s always so many brilliant opinions but I needed a strong sense of self before I got there. That’s why I kept it quiet. Each song’s different. “The Ghost Who Walks” came by lightning strike, really. I was playing the chords and “the ghost who walks, she’s on the prowl” popped into my head and I jotted down a whole story and that was the song. Other songs on my record, like “Pretty Babies,” I had an idea of how I wanted it to sound and I played around with the lyrics for quite some time, but it was maddening. I just couldn’t get it right. Then Rachelle came to Nashville and I began putting more of it together; I needed another insight into the song and it gave it a flair and a sassyness whereas before it was melancholy. I remember Jack talking to me, saying that the record’s almost done, but in the back of my head, I thought “it’s not.” There needs to be one more song, it was really haunting me. But I knew it was there. I spent a week just trying to get it out and failing miserably. An hour before we were to go into the studio and start mixing things, it just appeared again. It was “Stolen Roses.” I knew I needed that song on the record. I was trying to find a way of letting it get out.
[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW-CCOXP_tk]
